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[FETHULLAH GÜLEN ASSESSES THE AGENDA-1] ‘They have never known the real Muslim identity’ The distinguished scholar, Fethullah Gülen, recently answered the questions about the latest developments, and the resulting interview was posted on the Web site www.herkul.org. We present the entire interview to our readers.
There are certain ongoing attempts to drag Turkey into chaos. How do you view this situation?
These attempts have been made persistently for 300 years. Those external powers that became aware that they would be unable to deal with a strong Turkey are trying to cut the connection between the Anatolian people and their inheritance from the past, including their spiritual roots. These kinds of plots are by no means new. Only the methods employed and the plots staged have changed with time. The forms of the assaults against the spirit of the nation and the nature of the plots have changed depending on changing circumstances, conjectures, popular methods and schemes. These plans go back eight centuries, but in particular the crimes committed over the last three centuries are self-evident and need no further clarification.
Furthermore in the past the danger was outside and clear. As was the case during World War I and the War of Liberation, both the enemy and their enmity toward Islam were clear enough. That Gen. Allenby declared upon entering Jerusalem after the defeat of the brave Ottoman soldiers: “Salahuddin! The crusades are complete!” revealed their guile while revealing his courage. He actually declared the defeat of the Ottoman Empire as the victory of the Cross. So it’s clear that there were those who had bad intentions toward this nation. However, the assaults began emerging from within at some point. As reflected in the words of leading contemporary scholar Said Nursi: “In the past our dangers were coming from the outside, but now the danger is inside. The worm is inside the body and now resistance becomes much harder. I am afraid the nation cannot withstand it, since it is most likely unable to sense the extent of the danger. It will likely think of its most ardent enemy as a friend.” Yes, now there are many who pledge their allegiance to this nation and its values, but are insincere in what they say and manage to hide their real intentions. They are able to proceed with implementing their previously devised plans without apparently causing any trouble at all.
Those building on darkness are writing Judgment Day scenarios
Of course it would be a mistake to view everybody in this country as potential traitors and be suspicious of everybody, this should not reach the level of paranoia. But it is surely obvious that whenever Turkey has made remarkable headway, a series of provocations assume the stage. I still clearly remember that an economy professor drew attention to this as early as the 1960s, saying: “Whenever Turkey gets back on its feet and becomes ready to overcome its deep-seated problems and to compete with the entire world, certain foreign forces take the stage to instigate terrorism and create an atmosphere that will convince the people that everything is about to slip out of their hands.”
Today is no different. Some are writing apocalyptic scenarios and staging their horrible plays. As in some contemporary subversive movements, there are those who associate the descent of Jesus with the deterioration of the global order and believe that more blood and turmoil will induce the coming of the ultimate Liberator. They base their hopes on darkness, thinking that order will come out of chaos and that the world should be a venue for the commission of indescribable felonies to “force God’s hand.” This is delusion, madness and delirium. Those who believe in this nonsense are either blinded by their hatred or mentally ill people who require advanced treatment. Regrettably they are trying anything to inflict their poison upon our country and make it a place of bloodshed.
Some who are unaware of the culture of democracy simply cannot accept that people who do not share their views enjoy democratic rights and freedoms. And if they are distant to religion, they just cannot tolerate other people’s interest in the performance of religious duties. Thus their incomprehension of democratic culture reveals itself through their desire for violent interference. If the general atmosphere does not appear as they favor, they instantly explore causes for tension and seek to create an environment suitable to implement their plans.
However, there is one thing they are still unable to understand despite all the bitter past experiences: no good order comes from chaos in either the physical world or in social life. As for those who deny the story of Creation and believe the claims of evolution, that chaos transforms into order, contemporary experiments invalidate their assertions. Nature is opposite to this: chaos creates nothing but further chaos. Similarly in social life, no safety and security is obtained through the mobilization of the masses in the streets and instigations and provocations. Quite the contrary, turmoil creates more horrible turmoil.
Change limited to forms, the mindset remains the same
Unfortunately some are unable to see this reality. They try to cause turmoil and create an environment in which people will take their problems to the streets. They are trying to form a serious plot in which people would be unable to know why the killed was killed and the killer committed murder. They fool some miserable individuals and turn them into murderers. Then a few figures are publicized to provoke massive feelings and lead the masses to cause disorder and turmoil. Regrettably we have repeatedly witnessed this throughout the last 300 years. We saw the same in the removal of the Ottoman sultans from their thrones by their own subjects and the killings of the leading statesmen. And if things being done today are the continuation of the past, it means that outrages continue in contemporary forms. Change in the forms are made to ensure that the nation will not come to realize the same things are being repeated, and for this reason represents the presentation of the long-known anarchy in a different form.
To overcome this chaotic environment, those who put special emphasis on democracy, human rights and republic should believe in their discourse first. What was meant by the motto “sovereignty ultimately rests with the nation,” first voiced during the inauguration of the Turkish Parliament, was democracy. This principle implies that sovereignty was taken from some elite powers and given to the nation. If such a democratic understanding prevails in our country, wills and desires are transformed into reality and put into implementation at the polls alone. If this is the case, everybody should express themselves at the polls and speak of a democratic language. Those who believe their rights should act in accordance with democratic ethics instead of imposing their wills. They should try to fulfill their goals through democratic means and win the hearts of the nation.
Provocations are common in such chaotic environments. In almost all incidents religious peoples are accused. And even your name is sometimes inserted into accusations, with connections alleged between you and the accused. What is your opinion on this?
A small group that is hostile to religion and religious people do so at every opportunity they have. In this way they try to distort the actual discussion and want the slander to stick with the accused. They continue to reveal their hatred towards the faithful. Actually this nation bears witness that we favor order. The people of Anatolia know well that we would not hurt even an ant, let alone kill a human being. My life is proof of my determination not to retaliate, and to respond with good intention to those who inflicted only evil upon us.
Anatolian people know us
I would like to recall an incident I have a number of times shared before: it was at the time when I was preaching and reciting sermons in the mosques. One day a friend of mine told me his fear of seeing a bullet coming right through my head. In a very calm manner I told him I was doing that job knowing the dangers associated with it. Even in those days I told those who loved me that “If they kill me some day on this stage, take my body aside and go home as the representatives of order and peace.” I have always considered the peace of the nation rather than my own fate and I have never committed a mistake that would undermine the safe order.
For instance I was preaching in Üsküdar. One day intelligence officers said a bomb had been planted underneath the mosque. I consider this kind of death martyrdom. However, considering that a probable explosion would cause provocation that would lead the masses to the streets, I gave up preaching for a time. After a while I resumed preaching at gatherings. I received information indicating that an assassination was being plotted. I ended my preaching there for the sake of public safety and peace.
This is our overall style: We have done our best to be the representatives of safety and peace. We have remained distant from anarchy and turmoil. If others contend that we would act otherwise, then they do not know Muslims -- this means that they consider a handful of living bombs and base their views on these sporadic terrorist acts. They mix up the non-Islamic behavior of these terrorists with the people strongly dedicated to Islam. Yet I constantly insist that those who are willfully engaged in terrorism cannot be regarded as real Muslims. A number of times I have noted that Islam considers the murder of a single human being as equal to the murder of the all humanity. I have also clarified that Islam does not allow vigilantes to carry out punishments, but rather those who commit wrong should be prosecuted, tried and punished by public authorities. However, those who focus on the terrorist acts committed by alleged Muslims consider us identical with them.
My view of the military hasn’t changed, even in the hardest times
Whenever an issue comes up with regard to the military, certain circles instinctively mention your name and make a connection between you and the issue at hand. What would you say about this?
Some who are inherently opposed to religion and religious people try to attack us because of our religious identity and our possible contribution to the promotion of religious values. They accuse those trying to carry out beneficial services for the nation of reactionary tendencies and block their efforts. Actually even when referring to “radical Islam” or “moderate Islam” as separate things, they target Islam itself, but because they do not want to be known as apparent hostiles to Islam, they make classifications that they try to present as distinct groupings outside mainstream Islam. To satisfy their jealousy and hatred they want to eliminate religious groups, and to achieve this they try to rely on a powerful base. More accurately, they want us to make enemies of a power that they think we are unable to deal with. They disseminate libelous news and reports and make inaccurate comments. By doing that they want to attract the attention of the public institutions to what they consider dangerous.
I think those wise people who have acquired a certain status and position through their efforts would not be fooled by the libels of those circles of bad intention. They have not been deluded yet, I hope they will remain so in the future as well. I hope they do not overlook those very important services made to this nation and this society and proceed against them, being convinced by the allegations and libels.
On the other hand, as I indicated a number of times in my speeches and interviews, I am in love with the army. My views on the military establishment of my country have been known for a long time. Even though I performed my military service during the troubled times of the May 27 military coup, even these days did not change my positive views. In a post-coup era, I performed my service as the soldier of Gen. Talat Aydemir. This era was particularly marked by violence, hatred, outrage and everything else. There were frequent changes in the chain of command. Some officers threatened their ideological opponents. I was trying to stick to my personal religious duties, but I had difficult times fasting. However despite these heavy conditions, there was not even the slightest change in my views about the military.
For this reason I once said I would gladly serve again if called, and I say it again now. I am turning 70. I would go serve my duty if I was called right now. I would only remind my officers of my heart condition and ask for commands consistent with this condition. But I would also say I am comfortable with living in large dorms with, say, 25 soldiers. When I voice these feelings of mine about serving in the military, some criticized me saying that this affection is just too much. However my remarks are sincere. People generally tend to refer to the army as the guardian of the homeland. To me it is also the guardian of the sacred, the past, our national culture, our freedom and security. For this reason I would like to mention it with appreciation and respect.
I also believe that reckless and futile discussions about the state’s fundamentals should be avoided. I strongly suggest that every statement against deputies, ministers, prime minister and president and other important state figures should be carefully considered and be made with the greatest consideration. To me everybody should be respected, the dignity of every person should be protected and nobody should be degraded. But the leading figures of the nation should be praised and respected further. Because disrespect to them is by no means limited to their personalities, it also extends to the institutions they represent. Respect for them would necessarily mean respect for the institutions they lead.
In an interview I said I was sad to see Erdil Pasha seated in court, along with his wife and daughters in the defendants seats, and criticized the prosecution and trial format. I was of the opinion that another way consistent with the laws in effect was possible, I simply wished the media organs had considered what effects their allegations might have. Yes, the pursuit of justice is important and everybody is equal before the judicial system. However, the human dimension in the cases of those who brought to trial should also be taken into account.
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